From VW to Riceburner

buddhahead · 10-12-2006, 02:31 PM

Hello, I'm new here. I've been checking out various S2k forums to see where I might fit in. I use to be a '67 VW driver of the panzer group in Socal, but it got stolen a few years ago so I decided to check out the S2000. I got delivery of my '06 silverstone with optional hardtop a few months ago, I haven't regreted it since. My old VW was a highly modified 2 Liter stroker with 2 44 IDF Webbers, with a bunch of custom parts in the motor, tranny, and suspension. But alas it probably attracted the wrong sorts who have no respect for other people's property. Anyway, I still had the need for a toy that I could work on. The S2000 just happened to fit the bill as a tuner car.
It's still new, and I'm just feeling around for what I can do to make it better/faster. If anybody want's to cruise drop me a line

Java Junky · 10-12-2006, 02:40 PM

Welcome aboard Bud, you've obviously got experience but I'd still strongly suggest that you get familiar with your new ride before dumpin' money into it. It's pretty damned capable in stock form.
'Sides, you'll find somewhere else to spend it. 'Alway do, right?
Be well, n' best of luck with your new ride.

MattG · 10-12-2006, 03:26 PM

"better" is a subjective word. What I think is better is probably not what you think is better.

Top speed of the car is pretty much restricted by gearing.

Quicker acceleration - you have a number of choices:

N/A + bolt-ons does not give much gain for the money involved.

Centrifugal Supercharger kits (Comptech/Vortech) relatively simple to install, value for money, and reliable. Limited upgrades available.

Turbo is a bit more complex then supercharger kits, and therefore usually costs a bit more. Generally the higher the HP the more risk to engine. Have seen a turbo S do a 10.7 quarter.

FD Gears - trade in top end speed for quicker acceleration off the mark.

The diff in the S2000 is not that strong compared to some other cars. If you are contemplating high HP (eg turbo) you may want to modify your drivetrain.

You may also like to look into removing the clutch delay valve.

Java Junky · 10-12-2006, 03:44 PM

Matt;
I'm such a gremmy when it comes to this car: a clutch delay valve???
I know what it sounds like it does. Does it actually soften the clutch engagement n' would it's removal actually give a benefit by way of quicker response? I guess a cleaner, more positive engagement would translate into more immediate go.
My wrenches are entirely too dusty.
(Sheesh! If you're jus' "'avin' a bi' a' sport" I'm never gonna live this down)
Be well.
Java

buddhahead · 10-12-2006, 05:05 PM

Java, thanks for the welcome and advice. I will definitely take it slow, but what does a retired person do. House is done, children are grown, tuna season is over, and wifey likes quiet pusuits.
*Hope this helps...I don't mean to interrupt, but can't help myself from sharing.
The CDV is a valve which no matter how quickly you lift your foot off the clutch pedal, the clutch engages the flywheel at a constant (slow) rate. Effectively, it can save the driveline from shock, where an inexperienced driver dumps the clutch at high RPM. But in practice, all it does is prematurely wear out the clutch. It's like slip shifting, which is something you don't want to do with a high reving engine.

MattG, thanks for the info. I'm leaning towards the Computech SC with a different intake. I'd also like to use some coilovers to slightly lower the stance and prevent any body roll. I'm also thinking of changing the rear end or 6th gear to reduce rpm and enhance top end. This I think is gonna be tricky to mess around with powerband vs. rpm. Any suggestions?
Oh Yeah, better was used vaguely..."better" as in appearance just to make it unique.

gomarlins3 · 10-13-2006, 02:59 PM

Welcome to the site.

You mentioned changing the rear gears/ 6th to reduce revolutions. This is the second mention of this I have seen this week in S2K sites. I haven't heard of anyone doing it though. Many have gone the other way to get the 'lower' end to hook up better. This gives the S the sensation of more torque in the lower gears. I am not sure if going to a taller gear would be a good thing, but I am interested in someone's impressions of it after they did it. If you do it please keep us informed.

buddhahead · 10-13-2006, 04:41 PM

Gomarlins, I'm just starting to give thought to the mods. Firstly, I need to figure out what the powerband will look like once a Computec SC is installed. Once this is found then I can decide whether to change the rear end which will affect all 6 gears or change only the 6th gear in the tranny. For example, in my VW I was able to run 3:88's in my LSD, which with the added torque and hp gave me mediocre to good launches as well as run the freeways at a decent speed without high rpm's. Another way this can be accomplished is to run 3 close ratio gears and run a tall fourth gear for regular driving. This was the preferred method by many to run the quarter using only 3 gears leaving 4th for running the highways. Does anybody have any info as to what the powerband will look like if a SC is installed? I maybe just spining my wheels since Honda engineering is excellent.

gomarlins3 · 10-14-2006, 11:10 AM

Here was mine with 4.77's in 4th gear:

buddhahead · 10-14-2006, 03:17 PM

Gomarlin3, very impressive for a VW! Was it normally aspirated, if so were you running modified 48 IDA's amongst a host of internals. Also, was it streetable.

buddhahead · 10-14-2006, 03:19 PM

Forgot, with 4.77' what was your quarter?

gomarlins3 · 10-15-2006, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buddhahead

Gomarlin3, very impressive for a VW! Was it normally aspirated, if so were you running modified 48 IDA's amongst a host of internals. Also, was it streetable.

That's not a VW, that's the S SC'ed with 4.77 rears. I thought you wanted to see a power curve of a SC'ed S so I thought I would post that.

I haven't run it in the 1/4 mile.

Java Junky · 10-18-2006, 04:52 PM

Bud, you n' Go made for some interestin' readin'. Thanks.
Now about that "delay-valve-ectomy" . . how reasonable an undertakin' n' will it's removal bolux (as Clint would say, now there's a word that the younger folks have yet to embrace) up any black boxes/brains?
Be well.

Halo · 10-20-2006, 10:46 AM

Currently, Comptech doesn't have an application for the 06 because it uses drive by wire throttle. I'm sure they're working on it although I haven't kept up with the story.

As you can see from that dyno and mine below, the centrifugal kits basically just make the high rpm cam seem even more of a kick. They do almost nothing below 5000 rpm on an AP1. Notice Marlin's dyno doesn't show below 4.5K and mine shows almost no gain that low.

Java, search S2ki.com for "clutch delay valve" I'm sure I saw a couple of threads on how to do the mod.

karnito · 10-20-2006, 04:49 PM

Clutch delay valve; I have read something about that in the EVo magazine for the 350Z GT-S concept with cupercharger made by Novidem. Engaging the supecharge via push button. To me it has some electrical parts in the whole mix. Like the AC clutch for instant. Anyway, I thought I just post something in that regards

Cheers!

Java Junky · 10-20-2006, 08:09 PM

Thanks Halo, much obliged.
Do you think it's worth the effort?

Lots'a opinion/info at S2KI. 'Valve's scheduled for departure.
'Not too bright. All this time I've thought that somehow my clutch'd prematurely worn n' it was only showin' up when I pushed. Okay, so it was showin' up kind'a often. Not one of my more astute observations.
Thanks n' be well.
Java

Halo · 11-03-2006, 10:22 AM

If it was my car, I wouldn't mess with it.

10-12-2006, 02:31 PM	#1 (permalink)
buddhahead Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6	From VW to Riceburner Hello, I'm new here. I've been checking out various S2k forums to see where I might fit in. I use to be a '67 VW driver of the panzer group in Socal, but it got stolen a few years ago so I decided to check out the S2000. I got delivery of my '06 silverstone with optional hardtop a few months ago, I haven't regreted it since. My old VW was a highly modified 2 Liter stroker with 2 44 IDF Webbers, with a bunch of custom parts in the motor, tranny, and suspension. But alas it probably attracted the wrong sorts who have no respect for other people's property. Anyway, I still had the need for a toy that I could work on. The S2000 just happened to fit the bill as a tuner car. It's still new, and I'm just feeling around for what I can do to make it better/faster. If anybody want's to cruise drop me a line

10-12-2006, 02:40 PM	#2 (permalink)
Java Junky Resident Curmudgeon Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Joisey Posts: 4,925	Welcome aboard Bud, you've obviously got experience but I'd still strongly suggest that you get familiar with your new ride before dumpin' money into it. It's pretty damned capable in stock form. 'Sides, you'll find somewhere else to spend it. 'Alway do, right? Be well, n' best of luck with your new ride. __________________ In life-long pursuit of that most mythic of beasts: the ever-elusive perfect corner. Well . . . that, r' at least a whole lodda clear spin-out room.

10-12-2006, 03:44 PM	#4 (permalink)
Java Junky Resident Curmudgeon Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Joisey Posts: 4,925	Matt; I'm such a gremmy when it comes to this car: a clutch delay valve??? I know what it sounds like it does. Does it actually soften the clutch engagement n' would it's removal actually give a benefit by way of quicker response? I guess a cleaner, more positive engagement would translate into more immediate go. My wrenches are entirely too dusty. (Sheesh! If you're jus' "'avin' a bi' a' sport" I'm never gonna live this down) Be well. Java __________________ In life-long pursuit of that most mythic of beasts: the ever-elusive perfect corner. Well . . . that, r' at least a whole lodda clear spin-out room.

10-13-2006, 02:59 PM	#6 (permalink)
gomarlins3 "Enjoy the drive" Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Kuna Idaho Posts: 2,289	Welcome to the site. You mentioned changing the rear gears/ 6th to reduce revolutions. This is the second mention of this I have seen this week in S2K sites. I haven't heard of anyone doing it though. Many have gone the other way to get the 'lower' end to hook up better. This gives the S the sensation of more torque in the lower gears. I am not sure if going to a taller gear would be a good thing, but I am interested in someone's impressions of it after they did it. If you do it please keep us informed. __________________ Happiness is a nice road, great weather, and driving the S with Sue in the seat next to me. "Whatever you do, where ever you go, enjoy the drive." I know for a FACT that the last year of production of the S2000 is 2003!!!!! After that, it will be the S2200 under an assumed name.

10-14-2006, 11:10 AM	#8 (permalink)
gomarlins3 "Enjoy the drive" Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Kuna Idaho Posts: 2,289	Here was mine with 4.77's in 4th gear: __________________ Happiness is a nice road, great weather, and driving the S with Sue in the seat next to me. "Whatever you do, where ever you go, enjoy the drive." I know for a FACT that the last year of production of the S2000 is 2003!!!!! After that, it will be the S2200 under an assumed name.

10-12-2006, 03:26 PM	#3 (permalink)
MattG Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 363	"better" is a subjective word. What I think is better is probably not what you think is better. Top speed of the car is pretty much restricted by gearing. Quicker acceleration - you have a number of choices: N/A + bolt-ons does not give much gain for the money involved. Centrifugal Supercharger kits (Comptech/Vortech) relatively simple to install, value for money, and reliable. Limited upgrades available. Turbo is a bit more complex then supercharger kits, and therefore usually costs a bit more. Generally the higher the HP the more risk to engine. Have seen a turbo S do a 10.7 quarter. FD Gears - trade in top end speed for quicker acceleration off the mark. The diff in the S2000 is not that strong compared to some other cars. If you are contemplating high HP (eg turbo) you may want to modify your drivetrain. You may also like to look into removing the clutch delay valve.

10-12-2006, 05:05 PM	#5 (permalink)
buddhahead Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6	Java, thanks for the welcome and advice. I will definitely take it slow, but what does a retired person do. House is done, children are grown, tuna season is over, and wifey likes quiet pusuits. *Hope this helps...I don't mean to interrupt, but can't help myself from sharing. The CDV is a valve which no matter how quickly you lift your foot off the clutch pedal, the clutch engages the flywheel at a constant (slow) rate. Effectively, it can save the driveline from shock, where an inexperienced driver dumps the clutch at high RPM. But in practice, all it does is prematurely wear out the clutch. It's like slip shifting, which is something you don't want to do with a high reving engine. MattG, thanks for the info. I'm leaning towards the Computech SC with a different intake. I'd also like to use some coilovers to slightly lower the stance and prevent any body roll. I'm also thinking of changing the rear end or 6th gear to reduce rpm and enhance top end. This I think is gonna be tricky to mess around with powerband vs. rpm. Any suggestions? Oh Yeah, better was used vaguely..."better" as in appearance just to make it unique.

10-13-2006, 04:41 PM	#7 (permalink)
buddhahead Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6	Gomarlins, I'm just starting to give thought to the mods. Firstly, I need to figure out what the powerband will look like once a Computec SC is installed. Once this is found then I can decide whether to change the rear end which will affect all 6 gears or change only the 6th gear in the tranny. For example, in my VW I was able to run 3:88's in my LSD, which with the added torque and hp gave me mediocre to good launches as well as run the freeways at a decent speed without high rpm's. Another way this can be accomplished is to run 3 close ratio gears and run a tall fourth gear for regular driving. This was the preferred method by many to run the quarter using only 3 gears leaving 4th for running the highways. Does anybody have any info as to what the powerband will look like if a SC is installed? I maybe just spining my wheels since Honda engineering is excellent.

10-14-2006, 03:17 PM	#9 (permalink)
buddhahead Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6	Gomarlin3, very impressive for a VW! Was it normally aspirated, if so were you running modified 48 IDA's amongst a host of internals. Also, was it streetable.

10-14-2006, 03:19 PM	#10 (permalink)
buddhahead Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6	Forgot, with 4.77' what was your quarter?

10-18-2006, 04:52 PM	#12 (permalink)
Java Junky Resident Curmudgeon Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Joisey Posts: 4,925	Bud, you n' Go made for some interestin' readin'. Thanks. Now about that "delay-valve-ectomy" . . how reasonable an undertakin' n' will it's removal bolux (as Clint would say, now *there's* a word that the younger folks have yet to embrace) up any black boxes/brains? Be well. __________________ In life-long pursuit of that most mythic of beasts: the ever-elusive perfect corner. Well . . . that, r' at least a whole lodda clear spin-out room.

10-20-2006, 04:49 PM	#14 (permalink)
karnito Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 258	Clutch delay valve; I have read something about that in the EVo magazine for the 350Z GT-S concept with cupercharger made by Novidem. Engaging the supecharge via push button. To me it has some electrical parts in the whole mix. Like the AC clutch for instant. Anyway, I thought I just post something in that regards Cheers!

10-20-2006, 08:09 PM	#15 (permalink)
Java Junky Resident Curmudgeon Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Joisey Posts: 4,925	Thanks Halo, much obliged. Do you think it's worth the effort? Lots'a opinion/info at S2KI. 'Valve's scheduled for departure. 'Not too bright. All this time I've thought that somehow my clutch'd prematurely worn n' it was only showin' up when I pushed. Okay, so it was showin' up kind'a often. Not one of my more astute observations. Thanks n' be well. Java __________________ In life-long pursuit of that most mythic of beasts: the ever-elusive perfect corner. Well . . . that, r' at least a whole lodda clear spin-out room.

11-03-2006, 10:22 AM	#16 (permalink)
Halo Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 610	If it was my car, I wouldn't mess with it.

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