Hey folks needing help

[scott-altezza]

hi im new to this site and am in the progress of trying to buy an s2k, can use give me some advice when buying one and what to look out for, am i right in saying i want to be getting a 2003+ as brakes ect were upgraded due to problems in the older ones

[DJJSR]

Do some searches. There's tons of posts about differences between the AP1 ('00 thru '03) and the AP2 ('04 thru present).

Both models are great cars. Biggest difference is the motors. Ap1 was 2.0 liter with a 9k redline. AP2 is a 2.2 liter with an 8k redline, slight torque improvement and slight gear differences. Other minor refinements have been made over the years. Some guys like the latest and greatest (me) and some guys like the higher revving AP1. Drive both if you can.

When shopping, just try to find the lowest mileage car that you can afford, regardless of the year. Stay away from cars that have been "modded" as they have also probably been "beated".

If you find one that looks promising but need some more advice, speak up. There's some very knowledgeable people here that can be very helpful.

Welcome aboard and good luck finding your car. Take your time and get what you want. They're great cars, you're gonna love it!

[gomarlins3]

Originally Posted by scott-altezza

...a 2003+ as brakes ect were upgraded due to problems in the older ones

First of all, that isn't true. The suspension was changed in 2004 to make the car softer. The engine was changed to add some torque. Everything else was cosmetic. The 2003 is the exact same car as the 2002.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by scott-altezza

hi im new to this site and am in the progress of trying to buy an s2k, can use give me some advice when buying one and what to look out for, am i right in saying i want to be getting a 2003+ as brakes ect were upgraded due to problems in the older ones

When you find as car you like spend the money to get it checked out at your local Honda dealer. It will be the best peace of mind you can buy.
Each body panel has a tag with the v.i.n. # on. If a collison has happened to that vehicle and body panels have been replaced the tag will be absent.

Good Luck

Neil

[slowrodent]

Some really excellent advice from some senior (s2000-ownership-speaking!) members. Don's comments were right-on-the-money, but let me clarify one item. A modded car is not always easy to spot, as a lotta folks have taken to removing aftermarket parts and returning them to stock appearance... So it's really beneficial to know the history of any particular car.

The numbered panels (already mentioned) is another key.



I bought an '00 with 14k miles on it about 1 1/2 years ago. I paid a wee bit too much, but I have no regrets at all! It's been a great vehicle!

Best of luck
Kevin

[dezignpro04]

Model Year 2001

• Model year 2000 did not have a clock. Per Honda, it was intentionally left out due to the race car theme. It became standard equipment on 2001 model.
• Model year 2000 offered wind deflector as an option; it became standard with the 2001.
• Red floor mats became available.

Model Year 2002

• Public pressure was strong to replace the plastic rear window design with a glass window, equipped with a defroster, which became standard for 2002 model. The window is smaller in size and the top frame was redesigned to accommodate the glass.
• The UK Press release states “.. for 2002, there is a significant change in the suspension’s fine tuning. Spring rates have been increased, anti-roll bar stiffness reduced, and the gas-filled dampers (shocks) recalibrated. The changes have been made to improve steering feel and handling progression at the limit, while maintaining the response, grip and balance of the original S2000.” {All three changes would be for an understeer correction.}
• Anti-roll bars: Front & rear sway bars were reportedly changed. Originals were F: 28.2 mm (1.11") x 5.0 mm, R: 27.2 mm (1.07") x 5.3 mm. A new ‘02 owner says his measures: F: 26.11mm and R: 27.35mm.
• Springs: ‘ 02 rear springs have a new part number.
• Early stereo complaints were addressed in the 2002 model with an upgrade from 20 to 30 watts per channel and the addition of door mounted tweeters. The door speakers are blue-plastic, have no 'paper' cone, magnet is still small, but owner’s report the 2002 sounds vastly better.
• The solid aluminum shift knob could be cold as ice in winter or very hot in the sun, for the 2002 model it was changed to a combination leather and aluminum knob.
• The black interior color shade has changed to a dark grey or charcoal bluish black shade.
• The stereo has digital bass/treble/fade/bal controls. You push the right knob and set them as opposed to small black knobs that you would push to pop-out.
• The tonneau cover changed. There is only 1 clip on the each side to push in from underneath. The elastic bands straps on each side remain the same. Reportedly its easier to attach and doesn't appear to 'flap' up like previous design.
• The shade of wheels are a slightly darker silver with a little more metallic-flake.
• Heat and A/C fan are more powerful. The 2nd and 3rd fan speeds are noticeably more effective.
• A chrome ring has been added to the tail-lights.
• A metal ring has been added to the interior door panel pulls.
• The horn reportedly has a different tone.
• The plastic trim piece that outlines the dash, as well as the trapezoidal plastic plate in which the roof and hazard buttons sit, are made of a different color/finish plastic – a gray, grooved plastic rather than the bland black untextured plastic.
• The cupholder cover and trash hole behind it are textured plastic as opposed to the same untextured earlier ones.
• Interior leather and plastic colors have changed. For example, earlier Silver cars came with a combination of red and black interior. The 2002 model comes with a solid red interior (dash, doors, center storage, etc.).
• Radio design and color changed.
• It’s said to have improvements in the transmission to make it smoother and provide quieter shifts.
• The dead-pedal is now metal/rubber and matches the other pedals.
• A vinyl console cover replaces the carpet console cover.
• The buttons for the defroster and cruse-control on switches are a different shape.
• The new window defrost button is the cruise control on the right side of the steering wheel.
• There is a small subtle change in the trunk lid shape at the rear, near the trunk brake light. Reportedly this was to meet the Federal safety standard measurements.
• The tach indicator line is now white and the scale connected by a solid white arc line.
• The outside Honda badges are larger.
• A second post has been added to the carpeted floor mats to secure them.
• There is very limited cockpit storage in the race car tight confinements, so door panel net storage pockets were added for the 2002 model but they are too small for anything but perhaps a garage door opener.
• Paint color changes were made. In the US, Sebring Silver replaced Silverstone Metallic (the newer is a brighter silver). Suzuka Blue Metallic was added.
• Some interior colors were changed in 2002, for example, the red & black interior of the Silver car was changed to ‘all’ red.
• At mid-model year the banjo bolts in the engine lubrication system were upgraded from two-holes to four-holes each.

[dezignpro04]

Model Year 2003

• Only change was to offer white cars with a tan interior.
• A Honda dealer says the clutch disc changed for 2003.
S2000 “Modulo” or “Factory Performance (FP)” In 2003 Honda announced that its division Honda Access Corporation, a Japan based operation that specializes in improving the look and performance of Honda company cars, will undertake the S2000. The FP team is led by Makoto Tamamura, the chief suspension engineer for the original NSX. To begin with the team will concentrate on only the handling traits for performance; engine tuning may come later. As of early 2003, USA availability is undetermined.

Model Year 2004

(Second generation S2000).

ENGINE
To improve torque output, Honda engineers stroked the all-aluminum four-cylinder 6.7mm to deliver another 160cc of displacement and a slightly undersquare configuration. By Honda's measurement, there's still 240 hp at your command, only it arrives at 7800 rpm, some 500 rpm lower than previously delivered. This is because the increase in piston speed from the long-stroke layout would stress the internals to the breaking point at a higher rpm. It's one of those physics things.
• Redline dropped from 9000 RPMs to 8000 RPMs.
• F20C engine code changed to F22C ( 2.2 liter) in North America market; the F20C (2.0 liter) remains in production elsewhere. Reportedly Greece gets the F22C too with engine code designation F22C1.
• Through the use of a longer stroke (increased to 90.7mm from 84mm), the motor's displacement was increased from 1997cc (2.0L) to 2157 cc (2.2L).
• Basically a 500rpm shift of the horsepower curve (to the left, on the rpm scale). Thus the new motor makes the same power as the older F20C, simply 500rpms sooner at basically every point on the curve.
• Compression has been bumped up a tenth of a point to 11.1 (from 11.0:1) and the valve timing has been altered to enhance mid-range performance.
• 240hp at 7800 rpm (vs 240hp@8300 rpm) and 162 lb-ft @ 6500 rpm (vs 153 lb-ft @ 7500 rpm).
• This will improve oil consumption and reduce piston noise, Honda improved the cylinder machine honing process by bolting a dummy head to the block (a technique used in race engine building) to improve accuracy. It results in reportedly less than 25% of the deformation on a block.
• The enlarged displacement results in a 6-10% improvement in horsepower and torque from 1000 to 8000 RPMs. Honda claims at the normal operating range of 4500 RPMs the 8 ft-lb torque increase in real world driving translates to 15 ft-lbs over the prior years engine.
• Continues to use traditional VETC instead of iVTEC as on the K-series motors.
• highway gas mileage dropped 1 mpg
• Honda claims better acceleration in each gear, offset only slightly by the reduced top speed potential in each gear (in the older car, thanks to the slightly taller gearing and extra rev capacity, you're able to hold a gear a bit longer, resulting in better acceleration during that brief period where the '04 must up shift while the '00-'03 is able to remain in the lower gear).
• Throttle pedal travel was shortened and pedal effort increased. By reducing the diameter of the throttle body drum, pedal effort is increased approximately 10% at the completely shut end, and 6% at WOT. This was done partly to reduce the occurrence of accidental throttle input such as when the driver encounters a road undulation. Accelerator pedal travel was shortened by approximately 10mm.
• The '03's pistons whiz at 4906 feet per minute at 8900 rpm, whereas the '04's slugs rip along at just 4761 feet per minute at 8000 rpm.

TRANSMISSION
• A tighter secondary gear reduction ratio (1.206 vs 1.16) to provide a bit more snap off the line and to better match the characteristics of the new motor. This is also called the intermediate ratio and is the gear after the transmission and before the driveshaft. It goes like this: Crankshaft --> clutch --> transmission (gears 1-6 + R) --> intermediate ratio gear --> driveshaft --> rear diff --> axles
• 4% shorter ratios for 1st through 4th gears while the 5th ratio is effectively 1% shorter and 6th is effectively 2% longer, for a slightly more relaxed cruise speed. 5th gear ratio changed from 0.971 to 0.942. 6th gear ratio changed from 0.811 to 0.763.
• Carbon fiber synchromesh replace the solid brass ones for all gears except reverse. The new design features a brass ring with a carbon fiber element bonded on the inner surface, resulting in simplified mechanical components, increased synchronizer capacity, improved abrasion resistance, and reduced weight. The weight reduction and increased capacity translates to a smoother and quicker shifting feel. Further enhancing shift feel quality is a reduction in the load acting on the disc spring. Per Honda, this tweak results in reduced shift knob operational load and reduced harshness.
• transmission case rigidity improved

CLUTCH

• Redesigned clutch and clutch case.
• To reduce the "impact torque" of a high rpm clutch dump, the new clutch has an additional orifice at the sleeve cylinder, which reduces the torque reaction acting on the drivetrain, in effect a clutch delay system.
• The clutch case has incorporated additional rib reinforcements to reduce vibrations and noises generated by the drivetrain. The additional ribs have improved clutch case rigidity by approximately 10%.

DIFFERENTIAL
• Redesigned differential; it has been beefed up.
• By moving to an FCD material (from FC), the case rigidity was improved by 40% while the overall case strength was increased 20%.
• Gear fatigue resistance improved by 5% through a change in the shot peening method for the drive pinion gear.
• Driveshaft and connectors also changed to help take stress off the drivetrain

SUSPENSION & STEERING
• Front spring rates increased by nearly 7%
• Rear spring rates were softened by roughly 10%.
• Shock damper rates have been adjusted accordingly.
• Front stabilizer bar is unchanged.
• Rear stabilizer bar was reduced in diameter by 1.8mm to 25.4 mm to improve bump steer & cornering.
• To enhance steering feel and accuracy, the suspension geometry was altered slightly, lowering the steering knuckles by 1.5mm.
• The EPS (Electrical Power Steering) system features an optimized steer response gain, while the software was updated to improve steering linearity and agility. The steering gear ratio was also changed to match the new suspension and tire characteristics. Increased rigidity of the steering gearbox supporting mounts results in improved steering precision as well.
• One of the "features" of the outgoing S2000's rear suspension was its tendency to exhibit bump steer at the limits. Honda's engineers have attacked this issue from several angles. Rear toe in was reduced from -0deg 19' to -0deg 10'. At a 50mm bump deflection, toe-in has been reduced from -0.19 degrees to -0.05 degrees. Secondly, the rear roll center was lowered from 101mm to 92mm. Honda claims improved roadholding under full suspension compression or during severe body roll situations.
• Honda claims improvements in overall stability, steering accuracy/effort/feel, bump steer characteristics, wet performance/hydroplaning, high-speed stability, smooth ride comfort, choppy ride comfort, and at the limit controllability.
• steering wheel lock-to-lock increased from 2.4 to 2.6 wheel turns.
• steering ratio lowered from 13.8:1 to 14.9:1

CHASSIS
• Chassis code AP1 = MY00-MY03 chassis changed to AP2 with the re-designed bumpers and new headlights / tail lights.
• A new cross brace at the very front of the frame (positioned horizontally, in front of the radiator),
• Reinforcements at key crossmember joints
• Additional fixing points to existing braces
• Reinforcements to the rear wheel arch bulkhead
• Front suspension upper arm brackets were strengthened, further benefitting handling.
• overall weight increase of 25 pounds, from 2810 to 2835 pounds

WHEELS & TIRES
• New 17" wheels, wider in front and rear (by 0.5" and 1.0" respectively), wrapped in wider tires.
• In the front, 205/55R16s were replaced by 215/45R17 tires.
• In the rear, 245/40R17s bumped the incumbent 225/50R16s.
• Honda says both changes are key contributors to extended cornering limits.
• The tires are now Bridgestone Potenza RE050s, replacing the former model's Bridgestone Potenza S-02s.
• The new tires feature a completely different tread pattern, intended to improve the balance in performance between dry and wet conditions.

BRAKES
• To improve fade resistance and stopping power at and near the limit, the brake pad material has been changed from a non-metallic compound to a new metallic compound. The new pad material (Jurid632) provides greater frictional stability in high-temperature operating ranges.
• Master cylinder ratio has been changed from 6.5 to 6.0, resulting in an increased feel of rigidity and "build-up" quality (Honda's term for more stopping power in the latter stage of brake application under constant application). Honda claims less pedal travel is required than previously.
• The ABS system has been improved through the use of split-regulation yaw-control logic for improved stability on split-μμ surfaces when the ABS is triggered. Furthermore, though more powerful than before, the system (consisting of the CPU and modulator) has been downsized for both precious space and weight savings.

[dezignpro04]

EXTERIOR
• new nose job, with wider air intake and new headlights above it
• fake brake opening reshaped and moved inward
• new HID headlights using projector beams
• new LED taillights
• lower appearing rear bumper
• reshaped exhaust pipes, now oval
• spiral double horn unit replaces the current flat double horn.
• new color - Rio Yellow Pearl
• Spa Yellow dropped

INTERIOR
• new combination red and black colored seats
• more sculpted door panel inserts; shoulder room increased by 0.5"
• wave ignition key to make copying it more difficult
• reshaped steering wheel
• new tweeter and mid range speaker housings
• metallic-look trim
• new center console with two beverage holders
• dash changes including a new gauge cluster, reshaped roll where the start button and radio controls are located
• restyled aluminum finish.

Model Year 2005

Per 9/1/04 Honda press release “There are no changes to the 2005 Honda S2000.”

• On 2/15/05 the MSRP went from $32,950 to $33,150. Shipping is another $515.

Model Year 2006

The 39th Tokyo Motor Show, held from October 22 to November 6, 2005, at Makuhari Messe in Chiba, Japan, had dozens of cars and motorcycles on display, but it is the new S2000, equipped with even more advanced features than ever before, that shared the Motor Sports Zone stage with a rare close-up look at Honda’s F1 and IndyCar Series racers.

• MSRP increased to $34,050 and shipping to $550 for a total of $34,600.
• Drive-By-Wire Throttle System. Ues a computer sensor to input throttle as opposed to pulling on the throttle cable. It's all electronic. this has allowed for several other changes. The cruise control actuator, control unit, Idle air control motor have all been eliminated. Many early reports say the DBW is pretty seamless, with no delay to rev match on a downshift.
• Vehicle Stability Assist (VSA) with traction control. A combination of computer controlled throttle and individual wheel braking to control sudden changes in vehicle behavior. VSA has a turn-off switch where the defrost button (moved) used to be.
• 20 lbs heavier
• Redesigned road wheels
• Redesigned steering wheel
• New color, Laguna Blue
• Daytime running lights (DRL)
• Brake Assist, which helps drivers apply full braking pressure in an accident avoidance situation via the ABS actuator. Braking pressure is maintained momentarily after the driver's initial braking action to help the driver stop promptly. It deactivates when the driver releases pressure on the brake pedal
• Basic warranty is 3 year/36,000 but the power train was extended to 5 years/60,000 mile
• Exterior temperature gauge
• New seats; they no longer have seat back pocket and headrest speaker system is gone
• 4 of the 8 speaker audio system are integrated roll bar speakers
• Sebring silver and white only come with a black interior
• CARB emissions rating is now LEV-2
• Passenger-side airbag cutoff
• IAC Valve has been eliminated, along with the cruise control hardware; it is all controlled by the ECU for the DBW system. A gas pedal cable runs into the engine compartment to an actuator. From there it's electronic.
• New intake manifold, intake support bracket, and injector cover. With the new intake manifold casting there are no additional vacuum ports on the manifold. The intake air temp sensor has been relocated to the air inlet tube.
• Only one cam sensor
• New style map sensor
• IAT sensor has moved to the rubber intake tract
• Differential now has a breather box mounted behind it
• Fuel line at engine is now a quick-release type
• Air pump, associated lines and and control valve, have been eliminated
• Weight/and or/position sensors mounted in the seats
• Fan switch in the radiator has been replaced with a second CTS, in turn the fans are now computer controlled
• HO2S in the header is now referred to as an Air fuel ratio sensor
• If you leave the gas cap loose, you'll get a "CHECK GAS CAP" warning, displayed in the outside temp display
• Return-less fuel system. There is no longer a regulator on the fuel rail, it is built into the fuel pump module in the tank. The injectors, fuel rail, fuel feed lines have all changed. NOTE: Reportedly this makes Supercharger kits for the 00-05 cars incompatible.
• The cylinder head doesn't have injection ports machined. The cylinder head will not swap on the 00-05 cars. (with a stock PCM).
• SRS system. Several new components, front impact sensors have been added, as well as a passengers seat weight sensor. The Passenger airbag now is shut off when someone under a safe weight is in the seat. There is also a driver seat position sensor, which changes bag deployment force based on seat position. The passengers bag shut off indicator is above the radio door. NOTE: Reportedly 00-05 passenger seats will not function with the system, as the weight sensor is built into the seat rails.
• The hemholtz resonator on the exhaust system has changed shape/dimension; they are now oval, instead of round.
• ECM logic/SSD mode. The ECM/PCM performs several functions after the key is turned off and removed. You must wait at least 15minutes after the key is turned off before unplugging the PCM. NOTE: If you unplug the PCM while it's performing the SSD (self shut down) tests you can permanently damage the PCM.
• Maintenance minder system. The previous Maintenance Req'd light has been replaced with a new system. Oil life is calculated based on RPM's and operation conditions to determine oil change intervals.
• Air filter mounting stud has changed, the air filter from a 00-05 will not fit properly in the 06 airbox.
• HP is now stated at 237 - due to the auto industry wide change in how HP is calculated**

Model Year 2007

The following color combinations for the US market:

Rio Yellow Pearl + Black
New Formula Red + Black
Silverstone + Black
Silverstone + Red and Black
Berlina Black + Black
Gran Prix White + Red and Black
Laguana Blue + Black

Suzuka Blue and Sebring Silver are no longer offered for 2007.

[dezignpro04]

Model Year 2008

• revised spring and damper tuning that subtly influences steering feel and high speed vehicle behavior:
Front coil springs 7% stiffer and rears 9% over 2007 model
Front damping force increased 10% and rears 5% over 2007 model.
Front stabilizer bar (mm): was 26.5 x t4.5 in 2007 to 27.2 x t5.3 in 2008. Rear no change.
• Minor changes to instrument panel. The instrument panel has a revised meter design for the fuel and temperature gauges, adding to the aesthetics of the display. Specifically, the fuel and temperature meters now reside along the arc formed by the tachometer instead of a semi-circle configuration below and to the right of the tachometer.
• Minor revisions to the seat design.
• Tire Pressure Monitoring System (TPMS) added.
• Per Honda weight increased nine pounds over 2007's, 2864 vs 2855.
• New 5-spoke Wheel design

Model Year 2008 S2000CR

On August 15, 2007 Honda announced the addition of a club racer-inspired S2000 CR to the S2000 lineup. The S2000 CR (CR for "Club Racer") features are designed to appeal to enthusiasts who enjoy open track day events and also provide a more ideal starting point for racers who modify the S2000 for competition in club racing events.

This factory-tuned sports racer is lighter, stiffer and faster than the stock S2000. The S2000 CR has a much more aggressive look thanks to the aerodynamic body kit that features a front spoiler that wraps around the corners of the vehicle, rocker-panel extensions, a large rear wing and faired-in headrests. The car's handling has been made sharper with the use of quicker-ratio steering, firmer springs and shocks, sticky Bridgestone Potenza RE070 tires and larger-width rear wheels. Extra body stiffness comes from additional bracing attached to the storage area for the folding cloth top, which has been removed. In its place, buyers get a removable aluminum hardtop. This change also results in weight savings of about 90 pounds. The changes to improve the S2000's track times do not come at the expense of creature comfort. The CR can be equipped with optional air conditioning and an AM/FM stereo with CD player. The sport seats are clad in cloth with unique yellow stitching, and the interior is accented with carbon-fiber-style trim panels and a special aluminum shifter.

S2000 CR Exclusive Features:

• Firmer, track-oriented suspension settings for springs, dampers and stabilizer bars.
• Front coil springs 37% stiffer and rears 17% over 2008 standard model.
• Front damping force increased 50% and rears 32% over 2008 standard model.
• Front stabilizer bar (mm): was 26.5 x t4.5 in 2007 to 27.2 x t5.3 in 2008 and to 28.6 x t4.5 in S2000CR (+1.4 x -0..
• Rear stabilizer bar (mm): Rear: 25.4 x t4.5 in 2007, no change 2008 except for S2000CR to 26.5 x t4.5 (+1.1 x 0.0).
• Structural enhancements include rear body brace and steering gearbox brace
• Quicker steering ratio of 13.8:1 (compared to 14.9:1)
• More aggressive tires using ultra-high performance Bridgestone Potenza RE070 tires in place of RE050 tires; 215/45R17 front and 255/40R17 rear (a larger rear tire size by 10mm)
• Aerodynamic body kit for reduced coefficient of lift (Cl) and improved balance and reduce lift through large and specially-tuned front and rear spoilers. Lift is reduced by 70-80% depending on the roof configuration.
• Removable aluminum hardtop
• Sport muffler for a tuned exhaust note
• High-grip fabric seating surfaces with synthetic suede trim; black fabric seating surfaces with yellow stitching. Synthetic suede bolsters enhance lateral grip.
• Unique spherical aluminum shift knob rests 12.6 mm lower for a 6 percent reduction in shift stroke compared to the regular S2000 cylindrical shift knob (aluminum/leather wrapped). Additionally, shift load effort increases by 10 percent for even more direct feedback when engaging a gear.
• The S2000 CR instrument panel meters include a "peak-power indicator." When the engine is operating at peak power, a round, green light illuminates to the right of the digital speedometer.
• Omitted items for weight reduction: convertible soft top, audio system (optional factory install), air conditioning (optional factory install), spare tire and jack, and sound insulation. Relative to the base 2008 S2000, cumulative weight savings total 51 pounds (hardtop installed) and 99 pounds (hardtop removed).
• new wheel design in Kaiser Silver
• rear body brace has been added to the area previously occupied by the soft top, resulting in additional rigidity.
• Carbon fiber-style trim interior panels.

S2000 CR Weight Savings Summary

Eliminated components to save -51 pounds:
* Electrically-powered convertible soft top
* Sound insulation
* Spare tire and jack

Optional eliminated components to save -42 pounds:
* Air conditioning
* Audio system

User-Configurable components to save -48 pounds:
* Removable aluminum hardtop

Exclusive S2000CR components that added + 42 pounds:
* Front and rear spoiler
* Rear body brace
* Steering box brace
* Roll bar cowlings and hardtop mounting covers
* Heavier suspension components
* Increased rear tire size
* Tire repair kit

[lonestarbuzz]

geez dez, that must have taken forever to type out!

j/k

[SilverS2K422]

wow, not sure whos ganna read all that but its good info.