Stop Modifying Perfection

[gomarlins3]

Originally Posted by frontline762

Haha....so why is everyone pissed off though?

Here's why:

Originally Posted by frontline762

You know I thought there would be a lot more Honda enthusiasts in here, but all I'm seeing is a bunch of ricers with fartpipes and intakes and cheap ass ugly aftermarket rims on their S2000s

You just insulted almost every member on this forum and I took your comment personally. I have an aftermarket exhaust, intake, and wheels. I would venture to guess that if we went to the drag strip, road course, autoX course and car show, your car would lose all four. I may be wrong, but I don't think I am.

On a more positive note, I would like to take a moment to thank you for what you do to keep me and my family safe. You and your fellow military folk are true heros.

Now back to our regularly scheduled show.

[frontline762]

Thanks gomarlins3 and I love what I do so its not a problem...lol
and thanks s2ook for a sound reasonable explanation for my original post...thats all I was lookin for....and sry to everyone else for comin in swingin...its just that Ive been in the game for well over a decade now....and really cant stand the ol'ricer look...lol
So no one really answered how the clutch delay valve removal worked out for them though...
understand when I mean "modify" and "perfection" dont read too deeply into it...theres always room to improve lets get it right. Im also looking into a head gasket and intake manifold gasket among other things that really have anything to do with how the car looks.

[frontline762]

You guys are just so excited to see some action in this forum too...admit it...haha...theres always gotta be someone in here that everyone "hates"..lol

[frontline762]

Oh and thanks for merging threads Java...lol
And Bobby is a good boy of mine and we did serve in 101st together...now I just gotta get him to trash those Rota Slipstreams....lol...but I'd still go to war with him again in a heartbeat!...and thats real talk

[MattG]

Contrary to popular belief the engine is not maxed out for performance. Other factors such as reliability, noise and emissions are taken into account. For example there is evidence to suggest that on the 2L engine the motor will spin to 10000rpm without causing problems. The engine cut-out is a more sedate 9000rpm.

One reason why people change their air intake or exhaust is because of the sound. This is also the reason that they may fail emissions testing (too loud/emissions above limit etc). The stock dual exhaust is heavy compared to an aftermarket single exhaust. The downside of the aftermarket exhaust is that in many places it exceeds the local noise pollution limits (eg above 91 dB).

There have been various revisions to the S2000 over the years. The suspension geometry of the '07 and the '00 are different, the wheel sizes are different. The engine displacement has been increased and gearing revised. Even the air/fuel ratio between the different years of the AP1's has changed.

The drag racing comparisons I do not feel do justice to any mods. It does not refer to the baseline of that particular car, and furthermore the most telling factor in drag racing is the driver (shifting points, shifting speed, take-off). Similarly at the track driver skill plays a big part, unless of course you are side by side going down the straight.

Personally - I'm leaving my car stock (unless of course you count changing the oil, fuel and tires as a mod). But then again I have a perfect car with no clutch delay valve or intrusive VSA

[s2kx2]

Can't we all just get along?

[frontline762]

Haha...well VSA does kinda suck ...but one push of a button fixes that.

[frontline762]

Originally Posted by MattG

Contrary to popular belief the engine is not maxed out for performance. Other factors such as reliability, noise and emissions are taken into account. For example there is evidence to suggest that on the 2L engine the motor will spin to 10000rpm without causing problems. The engine cut-out is a more sedate 9000rpm.

So just kind of expounding on another thread (9k rev limiter) . An AP1 could very well rev up to 10k without potentially causing any problems. But an AP2 should'nt be rev'd to just 9k, or else the thing will like potentially throw a rod or somethin'? ...just askin'....pleasepleaseplease dont anyone get mad...lol

[optimists2k]

I agree with you to an extent. the s2000 is a classically beautiful and well tuned car that one can definately butcher, but in the right tuning hands s2000s can b beasts! Also some of us who have alove for that jdm modified look cant help but make the s2000 stand out a little. Carbon fiber hood and trunk, an aggressive stance, and a set of performance wheels in some nice rubber do just enough too seperate the driver who appreciates the performance of the s2k from the average "thats a cute car!" that you get from the stock look

[Boosted S2k]

Hey I have a supercharger that I put on myself, and exhaust, and those little ricer mirrors, and side skirts, and actually a very extensive list of mods. Shit I even painted my stock wheels with spray paint from pep boys, and I think it looks great. What do you think........


You don't like it, but others might, because we all mod our cars to express ourselves and not to impress someone else. I had 7 CRX's before my S, and they were all rice machines with huge exhausts and B series motor swaps.

Oh and I bumped my redline to 8,600 with the AEM EMS and the car ran great, so I would say it is safe to do so. Lots of people put AP1 ECUs on their AP2's and it worked fine.

[MattG]

Originally Posted by frontline762

So just kind of expounding on another thread (9k rev limiter) . An AP1 could very well rev up to 10k without potentially causing any problems. But an AP2 should'nt be rev'd to just 9k, or else the thing will like potentially throw a rod or somethin'? ...just askin'....pleasepleaseplease dont anyone get mad...lol

Just a few notes before I start:
F20C = 2.0L S2000 engine
F22C = 2.2L S2000 engine

The piston speed of the F22C @ 8k is about the same as the F20C @ 9k. But the stress/forces involved rise greatly with increased rpm.

As piston velocity increases you put increased wear on rings, rods and bearings. The increased stroke length of the engine creates high sideloading on the cylinder walls which at lower rpms would probably not be an issue, but when things get exponentially bigger at higher rpms it may certainly be an issue.

I have heard of somebody running the early model ECU (F20C) on a late model engine (F22C) that supposedly didn't cause problems. But I'm not sure if it was a race car and like all race cars they rebuild their engine quite regularly, or if it was a daily driver.

[Java Junky]

I've always agreed with anything that Matt's come up with n' this time's no different. (It's not that complicated really . . . when a guys always right, what's to argue?)
I'd also be really concerned about regularly runnin' an AP2 in stratospheres that Mother Honda's engineers reserved for AP1s.
While I'm sure that they both overdesign and limit on the side of safety n' longevity, as Stewie's been "pared n' honed" more than their bread-n'-butter vehicles, that overdesign n' limiting is likely cut alot closer to the bone than on your standard Honda.
While Matt technically breaks it down, I'm more of a no-frills kind'a guy: the little engine goes ka-blooie n' scatters it's once-functional little piecey-parts all over the immediate landscape.
N' this ain't against what you guys're callin' "modding". My concerns r' with safety n' the unnecessary grenadin' of perfectly good engines.
I'm not fond'a "mee-too"s, but, like Matt, I'm not so sure this particular "mod" is such a good idea.
Gettin' more efficiency (HP) out of an engine operatin' where it was designed to operate is one thing. Makin' an engine spin where that engine has never gone before while further stressin' it for more HP with other mods . . . Aye lads. Methinks we're in for a bit of a blow.
Be well.
Java

[gomarlins3]

Originally Posted by Boosted S2k

Did you see an increase in SC cooling with the larger AC radiator? Did your engine temp go up with the AC radiator sitting there?

[frontline762]

Originally Posted by MattG

Just a few notes before I start:
F20C = 2.0L S2000 engine
F22C = 2.2L S2000 engine

The piston speed of the F22C @ 8k is about the same as the F20C @ 9k. But the stress/forces involved rise greatly with increased rpm.

As piston velocity increases you put increased wear on rings, rods and bearings. The increased stroke length of the engine creates high sideloading on the cylinder walls which at lower rpms would probably not be an issue, but when things get exponentially bigger at higher rpms it may certainly be an issue.

I have heard of somebody running the early model ECU (F20C) on a late model engine (F22C) that supposedly didn't cause problems. But I'm not sure if it was a race car and like all race cars they rebuild their engine quite regularly, or if it was a daily driver.

u know I just knew someone was gonna bring up the displacement difference...yes yes i realize the 200cc difference and a mildly different stroke velocities at different RPMs...all I was saying is if one motor (AP1)can rev almost 1000k over stock(with internal mods ofcourse to expand the powerband) Then the ol' AP2 should be able to eeek out another 600rpms...thats all I was sayin you know? I mean what you think? I mean its not really that big of a deal in the first place but just some food for thought i guess...

[frontline762]

I guess me and bobby 'll have to switch out computers and see whats up...lol

[frontline762]

Originally Posted by gomarlins3

Did you see an increase in SC cooling with the larger AC radiator? Did your engine temp go up with the AC radiator sitting there?

And thats pretty clean .....Its done professionally thats all I was getting at...lol ....It don't "look" like some backyard shyt

[Boosted S2k]

Originally Posted by frontline762

And thats pretty clean .....Its done professionally thats all I was getting at...lol ....It don't "look" like some backyard shyt

It was done by me in my drive way, and I am no professional.

[Boosted S2k]

Originally Posted by gomarlins3

Did you see an increase in SC cooling with the larger AC radiator? Did your engine temp go up with the AC radiator sitting there?

about 15 degree difference and not so much heat soak.

[BoostedAP1]

I like rice.

[frontline762]

Originally Posted by Boosted S2k

It was done by me in my drive way, and I am no professional.

Well you may not be a professional but the work looks professional thats all I meant by that man...